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Thread: Neville

  1. #1

    Neville

    Big if true; Neville may have asked for his release last night. The story is that he was supposed to face Enzo last night instead of Kalisto, but walked out before the show and is now looking to get out (unlike Kalisto, he was supposed to lose, though how much that factored in is unclear). No word yet on if WWE will grant the release, but it does appear this story has legs.


  2. #2
    The Greatest of All Time LWO4Life's Avatar
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    This is so stupid on WWE's part. First off, they shouldn't have ever booked him to lose to Enzo twice. That's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. If they wanted Enzo to defend against Kalisto, then you have Enzo come out, brag about no one being able to touch him, he's untouchable, then Neville comes out, beats the hell out of him again, Angle has to fire him, then he moves to Smackdown where he can move up from the Cruiserweight division and wrestler great talent like AJ, Zayn, and others. They spent this whole year building Neville to be the King of the Cruiserweights, why do that if you don't move him up. This is super frustrating because it all made sense until you had the whole cruiserweight division beat the hell out of Enzo. Neville beats up Enzo, can't get his rematch, then moves up. They used the CW title to build him all year, and he made the CW title a legitimate title because it was nothing when he won it. Now it means something. WWE's mistreating of Neville is just straight up horrible on their part.

    I will say I am happy Kalisto finally won the cruiserweight title. For years, and I mean YEARS, I've wanted the cruiserweight title back, and I wanted Kalisto to hold it. I only have a feeling it's only going to be a couple of weeks. This has story line cop out all over it, as they booked themselves into a corner, and the only way anyone else can challenge Enzo is if they get a new champion, then Enzo wins back the title at the next PPV. Once I heard Kalisto vs. Enzo that night, I knew Kalisto is winning because WWE booked themselves into a corner. This has transitional champion written all over it, but I'm enjoying it for now.

    Still, I'm SO pissed how they've treated Neville. I'm sure Pac will go back to the International scene (dude is International, not Indy, NJPW is NOT an Indy, wrestling in the UK is NOT wrestling the Indy's) and build on his time in WWE. He should be worth a lot of money and I'd love to see him join a Bullet Club. His heel run really added more to his character which he can build on outside the WWE. WWE really, really dropped the ball, as I really loved everything he did for the CW title, I will always see him as one of the greatest CW champions in WCW/WWE history, up there with Rey Mysterio, Chris Jericho, and Eddie Guerrero himself. Happy travels Neville, you will truly be missed by this fan.

  3. #3
    Part of me sees this as him making a stand. I don't know anything, but I could see WWE granting his release, or granting a demand that gets him out of the division. Vince loves people who do this shit. If they value him, they'll appease hiim. He's one of HHH's boys. this isn't an outsider like Aries who is known to rub people the wrong way. This is Neville. A for NXT champ and a guy they were pushing pretty well before he got that ankle injury.



  4. #4
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    There were some positive talks between WWE and Neville in November, it was reported, but nothing has really come of it as yet.

    There's now two big theories in play. One is that Neville is just going to sit out his contract and wait for them to get pissed off enough to release him. And the other is that we're not being fed anything because he is going to be a surprise entry in the Rumble.

    What do you guys think is the future for Neville at this point?



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  5. #5
    I beat up Kong! Powder's Avatar
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    Entry in the Rumble, going to face Enzo at Mania to reclaim the Cruiserweight title.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Oliver's Avatar
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    Entry in the Rumble seems an intersting route.

    I'm thinking that the most likely reason Neville wanted out is that he probably wanted to move up to heavyweight again rather than continue on 205Live, where he's pretty much done everything he could and worked everyone he could in his time there. So a Rumble entry and a reintroduction to either Raw or Smackdown works. If WWE wanted him to reappear, I imagine all they'd have to do is give him reassurances that that would happen and he'd be back on board. It's more the fact that he should have been afforded that opportunity after single handedly making 205 worth a damn for a while and pulling the whole program up on his own back while others found their feet that, for me, is crappy about the whole thing. I mean, imagine being Neville and watching them throw behind Balor, who's a couple of inches taller but a few pounds lighter, on the main shows whilst being told that he has to compete on the cruiserweight show because (and let's just assume here) of his size. I'd be pretty damn pissed if that was the case.

    Personally I want to see him pushed to the IC title level.

  7. #7
    I beat up Kong! Powder's Avatar
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    But can Neville be an intense face? A Neville/Miz feud for the IC Title would be great, but I can't see Neville being a quality face. His original face run was bland and boring, but his heel work and championship run was amazing.

  8. #8
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    To be fair they didn't give him anything to do on it. He was just a finishing move. That's not on him, that's on the company.



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  9. #9
    I beat up Kong! Powder's Avatar
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    However, he could have tried some personality when he cut promos.

    But I do not know any of his NXT work, or his indy and Japan work, so if he can be a compelling face, then good for him, and run with it.

  10. #10
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    I don't remember him GETTING to cut promos before the turn, that's my whole point. Certainly can't have happened often. His whole character was look how great his finish is.

    I found him quite engaging in NXT, so take that for what it's worth.



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  11. #11
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    once you find your promo voice, you don't have to change too much to become a face... might not cut great face promos but Neville has the in ring and because of his heel work, people would be invested in him as a face.. in a way they weren't before because he literally couldn't make anyone care besides the finish.

  12. #12
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    I thouht we were heading to him as that face too until he walked out. Seemed the direction they were going. People wanted to see Neville kick the shit out of Enzo.

  13. #13
    You guys are really expecting Vince McMahon to give a big Rumble spot to a guy who walked out on him? Maybe if he were Punk, Steve Austin or a huge star he would, but at best Neville was a highly respected worker who didn't move the needle at all in terms of box office and ticket sales. Now he walks out and suddenly Vince is going to reward him for that with a Rumble spot and a decent push? Not a chance. You won't see Neville again until WWE stops holding him hostage (funny how no one is bringing that part up, especially since the people being silent on it are the same ones who wouldn't keep quiet about Ricochet's status) or until the contract is up and he can go wrestle in New Japan or whatever. Otherwise, he's done for now.


  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cult Icon
    You guys are really expecting Vince McMahon to give a big Rumble spot to a guy who walked out on him? Maybe if he were Punk, Steve Austin or a huge star he would, but at best Neville was a highly respected worker who didn't move the needle at all in terms of box office and ticket sales. Now he walks out and suddenly Vince is going to reward him for that with a Rumble spot and a decent push? Not a chance. You won't see Neville again until WWE stops holding him hostage (funny how no one is bringing that part up, especially since the people being silent on it are the same ones who wouldn't keep quiet about Ricochet's status) or until the contract is up and he can go wrestle in New Japan or whatever. Otherwise, he's done for now.
    Good points

  15. #15
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    Cult, that is closer to what I thought. Was beginning to think I was on my own...



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  16. #16
    I got you Prime!

    Seriously, thinking Neville is coming back is the same wishful thinking that has gone into a million other things fans have wanted that never happened (Punk returning, Bryan winning the Rumble when it was clear WWE was never going to clear him, Cena-Taker, Bryan being cleared by WWE now, so on and so forth). I get it; WWE can be a slog to get through and because they don't give us what we want half the time, we come with our own ideas of what we'd like to see, which then makes us even more disappointed when they don't happen. This Neville thing will be the same. If he were on par with Punk or Austin when they walked out, sure, I could see them bringing him back and giving him a run. But aside from hardcore fans, Neville was a guy seen as a midcarder who didn't even move business that much when he was King of the Cruiserweights. Vince is really going to trip all over himself to bring Neville back and give him a push? Come on; if anything Vince would bring him back and bury him deeper in the hole, which is probably why Neville (wisely) is just sitting at home instead of getting suckered in. If any wrestling fan wants to see Neville wrestle again, they should tell Vince to man up and let him out of his contract instead of forcing him to sit at home or come back to be a jobber.

    That's really what gets me the most. As a Lucha Underground fan, I can't tell you how many times I had to hear about how LU was hold Ricochet hostage (despite the fact that he could work anywhere in the world except WWE, TNA and ROH, with the latter two being places he had no interest in going to). Now WWE is doing the exact same thing to Neville, and these same people are now all "oh I hope he comes back! It's a shame they can't work things out!" Bullshit. He's being held hostage. Let him go WWE.


  17. #17
    Samuel Plan
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    I think you're bringing a bit of your own baggage to the table by the sounds of it Cult.

    Sure, it is speculatively easy to imagine Vince wouldn't be at pains worrying about whether Neville works for him or not and I imagine he isn't giving it much in the way of a second thought, but at the same time is bringing a mid carder back in a spot at a Rumble really to be considered "tripping over himself"? He gave Tatanka a spot in the 2006 Rumble, who I believe then stuck around for a while; was Vince to be considered tripping over himself to do that too?

    I don't think it's anything worth sweating over too much. It'd be awesome to see Neville get an entry and make another excellent contribution to the company. It would sort of suck if it didn't. But in extending your own logic, it's not as if he was a world shaker either way. That's exactly why I don't think it would be a big deal for Vince to bring him back by giving him a couple of minutes in the Rumble and a possible hot start to a new angle that might make him a bit of extra pocket money, or for him to just let Neville live out his contract.

    Nor would it lead to Vince "burying him deeper in the hole" as you say - unless Vinny has a curious preoccupation with over-reacting to simple gestures made by small time stars, as you essentially define Neville to be, by cutting off his nose to spite his face by deliberately not seeking out possible money making opportunities no matter how small they might be.
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  18. #18
    Tatanka didn't walk out on Vince McMahon just a few months before, nor was he given a rocket push afterwards.

    My point is that everyone here seems to think that Neville, just because he's a great worker (and he is exceptional), is going to just be able to come back in and suddenly get a push higher than he was before. That's not how this works! To the best of my knowledge, the only guys Vince ever pushed after they walked out on him was Ultimate Warrior and Steve Austin, a legend and an all time great wrestler/draw. Neville is great; he's not Warrior or Steve Austin in terms of recognition, which makes it hard for me to believe that Vince would suddenly turn around and say "let's push this guy who walked out on us." Maybe Triple H would do that, but he's not in charge. It's not that I don't think Neville is deserving or that he's a no name; in fact, I clearly stated that Neville was seen as those things by casual fans and WWE (which is true; he otherwise wouldn't have been in the wasteland known as the Cruiserweight Division if he was seen as otherwise). But just because I don't think that or anyone else here doesn't think that doesn't mean we're right; the reality is that nothing Vince has done over Grodd only knows how long suggests he would bring Neville back and then suddenly make him an IC Title contender. The only people suggesting that are fans who are being wishful thinkers, and while I don't wish to belittle that, I also don't think it's wise to have false hope over something that more than likely isn't going to go the way people want it to.

    Also, none of that changes the fact that I've yet to hear a good reason why it was okay for LU to be criticized for not letting Ricochet go, while everyone remains silent on the Neville thing when it was clear he wanted out and wasn't allowed. Why else would he have walked?


  19. #19
    Samuel Plan
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    I can't speak to your bitterness over this LU issue of which I have seen or heard absolutely nothing, but WWE making talent wait out contracts is absolutely nothing new. The likelihood is nothing has been said about it because WWE can't sink lower in the opinions of the masses than it already has and because most are fully aware of the promotion's behaviour when it comes to talent relations. It's not for me to say; though you might be shouting into something of a void about it?

    It's all just speculation really. I legitimately don't think it's a very big deal, and my underlying point is that I especially don't think it's so big a deal that higher ups would even go through a train of thought that consciously thinks "placing this dude in the mid card around a mid card title is way more than he ever deserves after what he pulled!" - that, instead, it would largely return to being business as usual. That's all. And that it would more than likely, if it were to happen, result in Neville finding his way into some multi-man mid card match at 'Mania.

    Of course, we saw Alberto Del Rio walk out on the company over an explosive race issue, and then return to beat John Cena clean in less than ten minutes for a title Cena had held for the better part of an entire year. WWE chase a Latino demographic consciously of course, but the point is that stranger things have most certainly happened, and WWE have been building their brand and relationships on the UK Indy scene too. I don't think it'd be a particularly unexpected occurrence in such an environment if we saw Neville again, or saw him in the mid card; but it's hard to debate against the folkloric image of Vince McMahon being everything that's wrong with pro wrestling.

    Beyond anything else, I don't want to live in a world where wrestling fans of any organisation stop wishing for the unlikely. Such cynicism should be unwelcome in an industry built on fantasy.
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  20. #20
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    I don't think anyone would say Vince is all that is wrong with wrestling. But there's one hell of a track record there, plenty of hypocrisy, spite, and a fair bit of scheming. So it's not a stretch to imagine him acting like a shit in almost any given situation, if you have been paying attention to how he acts and what he is capable of.

    I don't really see the decision having much to do with Neville really. But there's a balance, against how much money they think they can get out of a big Neville return up against being seen to encourage people walking out on them in the future.

    In the case of ADR they obviously always thought he was worth the effort. And while I am way more interested in Neville, I am not sure that anything that has happened in his WWE career to date would make them think he was worth sending that kind of message to the rest of the locker room. I may be wrong on that, but it's my instinct.
    Last edited by Prime Time; 01-19-2018 at 04:11 AM.



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  21. #21
    The Brain
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    I actually thought Neville was already released. I'd be surprised to see him back so soon, but I guess anything can happen.

  22. #22
    Senior Junior SirSam's Avatar
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    I have absolutely zero expectation of Neville coming back and am honestly not sure where the speculation has come from. Seems more blind hope than any kind of real knowledge.

    From what we know about the WWE in general Vince tends not to reward stunts like the one Neville pulled, walking out at the last minute.

    If he came back then that would be awesome but as I said I just don't think it is really possible given the line Neville drew in the sand and how McMahon generally reacts to wrestlers that do what he did.

  23. #23
    The Brain
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    Also, of all the wrestlers people claim could do well in New Japan (Ziggler comes to mind), Neville is one guy who actually could probably could hack it on the top level there.

  24. #24
    Senior Member Oliver's Avatar
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    Now I want to see Neville in the Jr picture. Neville Vs Ospreay? Neville Vs Kushida? Neville Vs Hiromu? Sign me all the way up.

  25. #25
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    And I think he has easy potential to break into the heavies too. Or split the difference and just do Neville/Ibushi and watch the universe explode.

  26. #26
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    His whole King of the Cruisers gimmick would be a very simple copy and paste straight into that mix.

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    On another site I saw a claim that his contract has been frozen by the WWE, so his time isn't even running down yet.

  28. #28
    Senior Junior SirSam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quasar View Post
    On another site I saw a claim that his contract has been frozen by the WWE, so his time isn't even running down yet.
    That doesn't sound legally right but then again that is more me thinking about what I feel is fair and what the 'vibe' of the law is. WWE's lawyers wouldn't do it if they couldn't.

  29. #29
    Senior Member Oliver's Avatar
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    Presumably that would be similar to what they did with Rey?

  30. #30
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    I hope he answers Bobby Roode's challenge

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    I guess they weren't thinking Rumble and he is sat at home then

  32. #32
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    It's funny, one of the last things in the press I saw from Enzo before his release was basically a 'go get him back' appeal. Clearly Enzo wanted him back - may be the desire to hold him will be smaller now?



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  33. #33
    For the love of all things. They are holding this guy hostage even though he wants to leave; they should let him leave. When LU did the same thing...no it wasn't even the same thing to Ricochet because he could still work other places, but when they did a similar thing everyone and their brother couldn't wait to slam them, their fans and so on about how LU should let him go. Now the WWE is doing even worse to Neville (Meltzer all but insinuated his contract has been frozen the same way they did to Rey Mysterio and Bryan not to long ago) and we're just going to act like it's no big deal?! What the hell man.


  34. #34
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    And didn't they add on time to Rey's contract cause of the injuries and time he missed and made him sit out even longer? Quite petty that.

  35. #35
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    I wouldn’t let him leave. He signed a contract and walked out like a baby. And I’m not saying he shouldn’t be frustrated but he signed a contract. I felt same about all the guys you mentioned too. It sucks for Neville but a deal is a deal.

  36. #36
    Senior Member Oliver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cult Icon View Post
    For the love of all things. They are holding this guy hostage even though he wants to leave; they should let him leave. When LU did the same thing...no it wasn't even the same thing to Ricochet because he could still work other places, but when they did a similar thing everyone and their brother couldn't wait to slam them, their fans and so on about how LU should let him go. Now the WWE is doing even worse to Neville (Meltzer all but insinuated his contract has been frozen the same way they did to Rey Mysterio and Bryan not to long ago) and we're just going to act like it's no big deal?! What the hell man.
    I'm with you, Cult. If the guy wants to leave and you're not using him, at the very least let his contract run down. Failing that, let the guy buy himself out of it. Don't freeze the thing. I thought it was awful they did it to Rey, as well.

  37. #37
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    I don't know about any one else but I am not thinking it is no big deal. I posted the comment about that news story more as a 'maybe there is light at the end of the tunnel'.

    Usually speaking, I tend to back honouring the contract, so I would support LU on Ricochet and WWE on Neville. But I dunno, it's not like Neville is Steve Austin and he can go to WCW in 1998. The business ramifications for them are limited, and the... Aggression, for the lack of a better word, with which they have contested this has left me with a disdain for the WWE position. I find myself hoping he does stand up to them and get his release.



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  38. #38
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    WWE was using Neville and had him as a face of a brand. It’s not like they had nothing for him.

  39. #39
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    No, but he wasn't happy with his position and so let his contract run out and let both parties move on. I don't know what's going on behind the scenes but by freezing his contract, you just make yourself the bad guy. We don't know exactly why he left but he's not been pressured to return by doing this so what is the point? It just comes off petty.

    Also to me, I don't treat WWE contracts the same way i would say sports contracts. I hate when athletes hold out for example. A football player will get paid what they are worth on their next contract. WWE its not merit based. Neville can work his ass off and be told this is the spot for you, you're never getting higher, you won't be making any more money.. etc.. If you think you're worth more, you should be allowed to leave imo

  40. #40
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    I mean maybe I'm just old fashioned, but I tend to believe when you make an agreement you should stick to it. But that applies as much to LU, a promotion I don't watch, as to WWE, which I do. But when a relationship breaks down to that kind of degree... the only real reason I can see to hold out on someone is if it actually hurts you to let them go. And I just don't think anyone can convincingly make the argument that Neville is the kind of star that can do that. Yes, he can be a player for someone else and yes, he can have the rest of his career, but realistically he isn't going to be performing for anyone that is going to pose any kind of threat to the 'E.

    Or to put it another way - in the days were WWE had real competition I'd understand them holding people to what they've signed, but if people don't want to be there now I don't know why you bother trying to force them when you're never going to get their best work. It's not like there isn't enough talent available to them to just go 'next man up'.



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