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Thread: UFC/MMA Discussion

  1. #1
    Senior Member Killswitch's Avatar
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    UFC/MMA Discussion

    All UFC discussion here.

    Damn close fight between Gus and Jones. I thought Gus edged it out, but Jones really showed the heart of a champion fighting through.

  2. #2
    The Hurra Duff
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    I say let them fight again Super Bowl weekend.

  3. #3
    GloryholeThemePark
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    I agree, the rematch needs to be Superbowl weekend. Whoever had the fight 49-46 should be shot or fined for taking bribes off Nike. I had rounds 1, 2, 3 for Gus and he landed far more significant strikes. Can't Wait.

  4. #4
    Senior Member Killswitch's Avatar
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    I'd say give Gus a gimme fight like JDS got with Hunt and build the rematch up. Could be major dollars.

  5. #5
    GloryholeThemePark
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    The difference is, JDS vs Cain II wasn't remotely as close as the Gus Vs Jones fight. Gus doesn't need to rebuild credibility. Also if you think JDS vs Hunt as a gimme fight, you're deluded.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Killswitch's Avatar
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    It was. Hunt had absolutely nothing for JDS. I like Hunt, but that fight was put together with the expectation that JDS roll through him.

  7. #7
    The Hurra Duff
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    Maybe do Gustaffson vs. Glover Texiera first.

    Let Glover at least beat one top ten LHW before facing Jones.

  8. #8
    THE MONKEY
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    Gus/Jones was definitely close and on first viewing I was undecided but thought it could go either way. I re-watched it on Sunday and now I think Jones was definitely the clear cut winner. Rounds 1 and 2 were kind of subjective. I felt Jones was more the aggressor and controlled the center of the octagon and he actually outstruck Gus in those rounds. Round 1 would basically come down to how you viewed the takedown, it was big but at the same time it wasn't like Gus did anything with it. Round 3 I think was the only 100% clear cut round for Gus, that's when he really started to put together some great combinations. Funnily enough everyone seems to agree that Jones won the 4th and 5th rounds yet if you rewatch the fight I think a serious case could be made that Gus won round 4. To me it came down to who could win that final round and Gus just didn't have enough in the tank, props to staying up though. He ate a couple solid head kicks when it already appeared he was barely standing.

    Definitely gained a lot of respect for Gus from that fight, going into it I viewed him as severely overrated. As bad as I would like to see a rematch, I think they should hold off for the division's best interest. If they have a rematch right away and Gus loses then he's screwed, at least while Jones is champ. If Gus wins (barring him pulling a Shogun in the second Machida fight) then chances are we'd get a trilogy which would tie up the division longer. I say let Glover have his shot and let Gus face the Sonnen/Evans winner.

  9. #9
    Is Your Superior PEN15's Avatar
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    This is a wrestling based site, so I apologize if I'm letting WWE booking interfere with my thinking, but wouldn't it be best to strike while the iron is hot for the rematch? Let's say Gus takes on the winner of Sonnen/Evans, and then loses? The rematch is no longer an option. People want to see the rematch now.

    Also, consider what would sell more right now: Bones vs Gus II or Bones vs Glover?

    It seems like an obvious decision to me.

  10. #10
    THE MONKEY
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    Yeah but if you give it time you could potentially draw in more than just the casual fan. Silva/Sonnen II had some time in between it (though not totally for reasons in their control) and the second fight still managed to have 400,000 more buys than the first. I just think they are better suited to make a big deal about a rematch rather than just go ahead and outright book an immediate rematch.

  11. #11
    Is Your Superior PEN15's Avatar
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    I don't think Jones vs Gus, with the aid of Dana and UFC, could promote the fight as well as Chael does on his own. What I mean is that comparing it to Sonnen vs Silva is a lofty goal.

    The reason most rematches work with time in between is because there's a dramatic element added to it. Shamrock vs Tito with their hatred, Sonnen vs Silva is obvious. On the other hand you had Chuck vs Randy in a trilogy that was based on respect only, and doesn't match the legacy or the numbers the others did. Also, The Mauler isn't the top level name that Couture or Liddell were either. I think time won't really add much in terms of buyrates for these reasons (lack of hatred/drama + Gus name power).

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    I think they need to have to rematch immediately. In fact I think Gustaffson more then earned it. The only thing that will add buys to a match between them is a bigger arena and a better card. If they don't do an automatic rematch I'm gonna guess they will fight each other Superbowl weekend pending them beating whatever opponents they face between then. I'd give Gus a lesser challenger most like but Jones has his hands full once again with Texiera so its a gamble.

    The more and more Jones fights the more he shows he can have an off day like anyone else. Someone is bound to figure out a way to beat him sooner then later. Gus may have created the blue print but someone else might step in and implement them correctly.

  13. #13
    THE MONKEY
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    Even if they do fight each other again immediately I doubt it'd be before Superbowl weekend and that may be pushing it. You figure each guy has a mandatory 60 day medical suspension plus they'd still want a decent camp. I'd figure March or April will be the next time Jones fights.

    I don't think it's so much that Gus created the blueprint rather than show that Jones' biggest strength is his reach advantage. Most guys can't come close to hitting him so they get battered by Jones. Problem is nobody in the division outside of Gus will be able to negate that advantage.

    As for Glover, I like him a lot but he gets too reckless sometimes and you can't do that against Jones. Though his takedown defense may serve him well because he has the ability to knock out anybody if he can put hands on them. I just worry about Glover getting pushed to five rounds, I've seem him gas badly in the third before.

  14. #14
    Senior Member Killswitch's Avatar
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    I don't honestly see Glover having a lot for Jones.

    The fighter that eventually beats Jones will be similar to Gus. Similar height/build while not being completely dwarfed reach wise.

    EDIT

    Jones/Glover confirmed, likely for February 1st.
    Last edited by Killswitch; 09-26-2013 at 03:53 AM.

  15. #15
    THE MONKEY
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    Yep, didn't realize the Superbowl card was in Jersey so that makes sense.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Jones
    "
    "I said before the fight my sights were set on breaking the record," Jones stated. "I want to crush the record. I want to beat the record so bad it can never be broken. I'm going to fight Glover and I will answer all the critics about the Gustafsson fight. I will fight Gustafsson after I fight Glover. I won the fight but I look at it as a blemish on my record because some people think I didn't. I promise you, he will be next."
    Apparently the word is Gus will fight again early next year in Sweden.

  16. #16
    The Hurra Duff
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    Glover has the power to KO Jones but I don't think he'd get close enough to Jones to do it.

  17. #17
    THE MONKEY
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    Let's not forget that Glover actually has a ground game. He has 5 submission wins in his last 10 fights, so he could possibly give Jones some problems on the ground as well. I think the key will be the first two rounds, if Glover can't take it then I don't see him taking it. He'll definitely need to be smarter with his strikes though and abandon his "take one to land one" approach because Jones will eat him up with his reach if he does.

  18. #18
    Senior Member Killswitch's Avatar
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    Yushin Okami has apparently been cut by the UFC.

    What a joke. This is worse than the Fitch cut.

  19. #19
    THE MONKEY
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    It's a bit strange, but again you have to look at the money Okami was making. And as much flack as they caught for cutting Fitch, look how badly he lost in his WSOF debut. Do I think Okami is good enough to be in the UFC? Yes. I think they just viewed it as him making more money than he's worth at this point since he's never gonna reach the top of the heap.

    EDIT: Bisping due to an eye injury is out of his fight with Mark Munoz and now Lyoto Machida is taking his place, leaving Tim Kennedy without an opponent for the Fight for the Troops main event.
    Last edited by THE MONKEY; 09-28-2013 at 07:55 AM.

  20. #20
    Senior Member Killswitch's Avatar
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    Ben Rothwell tested positive for elevated T levels. He's been on TRT, claiming to have hypogonadism from a car accident in 1999.

    Brandon Vera probably dodged yet ANOTHER bullet.

  21. #21
    THE MONKEY
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    I don't think the W is getting overturned though since he wasn't punished by the commission. The UFC doesn't have the power to overturn a decision. They did suspend Rothwell though.

    In other news the Mir/Overeem bout got moved to the Superbowl weekend card.

  22. #22
    THE MONKEY
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    Rouisimar Palhares got cut after that crap he pulled on Mike Pierce last night. I say good riddance, UFC has no place for somebody he refuses to follow the rules. Second time he's done it in the UFC and he's done it multiple times prior.

  23. #23
    Senior Member Killswitch's Avatar
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    Just saw that and gotta agree. Guy was eventually gonna end a career doing that shit.

  24. #24
    THE MONKEY
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    Who does everybody got for Saturday's fights?

    I got

    Velasquez
    Cormier
    Melendez
    Gonzaga
    Dodson

    Boetsch
    Marquardt
    Kaufman
    Noons

    HOPING for JDS and Nelson wins though. Nothing against Velasquez, I just like JDS more. As for Cormier, I feel he's overrated as a fighter and would like to see him knocked down a peg.

    Not sure how Cormier is looking but Nelson is looking to be in great shape.
    Last edited by THE MONKEY; 10-19-2013 at 02:34 PM.

  25. #25
    Is Your Superior PEN15's Avatar
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    I didn't catch from the end of the women's fight until the beginning of the co-main evemnt, but I loved what I saw, and know I'm in for a treat when I do watch the rest. What a night.

    What are the chances Big Country gets cut after that loss? I hope he gets a shot at LHW (if that's his goal) before they cut ties with him, but there can't be too many chances left.

  26. #26
    THE MONKEY
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    Doubt he gets cut, as despite the headache he causes Dana has said multiple times that he likes Nelson. He's basically the type of fighter that will always have a job with the UFC (unless he starts getting knocked out) simply because of his willingness to stand and trade. I do think he needs to work on better striking combinations rather than being the heavyweight version of Dan Henderson (with worse wrestling) in the sense that he just stalks his opponents looking to land the big right hand.

    In terms of the card, from the untelevised prelims right up to the main event the card really delivered.

  27. #27
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    Country signed a 9 fight deal. This fight being the first on it.

  28. #28
    Senior Member Killswitch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PEN15 View Post
    I didn't catch from the end of the women's fight until the beginning of the co-main evemnt, but I loved what I saw, and know I'm in for a treat when I do watch the rest. What a night.

    What are the chances Big Country gets cut after that loss? I hope he gets a shot at LHW (if that's his goal) before they cut ties with him, but there can't be too many chances left.
    Guys who will stand and bang get almost infinite chances. Dan Hardy lost 4 times in a row and didn't get cut.

    That was an awesome night of fights. Melendez/Sanchez was off the wall.

  29. #29
    THE MONKEY
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    I have to wonder if Diego kept attacking with strikes when he dropped Melendez rather than going for the submission, if Diego might have pulled it off.

    Big Country won't get that many chances but generally that rule is pretty accurate. Hardy getting so many chances had more to do with the fact he was HUGELY popular in the U.K. and the UFC was drastically pushing it's Global expansion.

    GSP/Hendricks....who does everybody got? I think 2/3 times, GSP can win that fight but I think Hendricks is taking the belt. Basically gonna to be a Serra situation all over again. Sonnen/Evans is pretty intriguing as well. Once upon a time I would have laughed at the prospect of Chael beating Rashad but I think the beast that Rashad once was is gone. He just seems to have caught "Rampage" syndrome in the sense that he just seems so unmotivated for his fights lately.

  30. #30
    Is Your Superior PEN15's Avatar
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    The main reason I question Big Country's stay in the UFC is because of the recent string of cuts of guys who are top 10, but would never be champion. I understand that Nelson is a different fighter than Okami and Fitch, but there is HW Cheick Kongo who was released with a record similar to Country's. I agree Nelson is more marketable than Kongo, has a slightly more impressive record, and a strong history of entertaining fights, but I still wonder Dana's assessment of his worth.


    I don't care how many "entertaining fights" Diego Sanchez puts on, all he's good for is taking a savage beating and stay standing. He doesn't deliver anything competitive. Oh, and he's a shithead.

  31. #31
    The Hurra Duff
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    Does the winner of Browne/Barnett get Velasquez?

  32. #32
    Is Your Superior PEN15's Avatar
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    No. Werdum is apparently next.

  33. #33
    Senior Member Killswitch's Avatar
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    Completely agreed on Diego. Once upon a time he was a damn good fighter. But the wars are catching up to him. He's beginning to sound punch drunk.

    Also, I'm picking Hendricks. GSP has lost a big step since the ACL injury.

  34. #34
    THE MONKEY
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    Kongo wasn't cut, he got offered a contract before losing to Roy Nelson and didn't resign. After being brutally knocked out again I think he definitely lost some bargaining power.

    The fact that the HW division is incredibly thin helps Roy out a lot. Plus he tends to score some big knockouts which is very easy to market. Guys like Fitch and Okami were always harder to sell in that sense, while both are tough they are more known for smothering their opponents which doesn't go over well with the casuals. Not saying it's right, but it is what it is. I honestly think Nelson would either A.) be in a Dan Hardy situation and lose rather than win B.) do something insanely stupid or C.) get viciously knocked out in order to get cut. With A) 5 loses in a row would simply be too much to ignore, B) Roy has a history of doing stupid shit so it'd have to be something crazy and C) when Roy's chin finally fails him a bit selling point is gone.

    At this point give Roy Rothwell in a rematch. Rothwell wants a step up in opponents and both could use the win. A Gonzaga/Nelson fight could be interesting too but a bit unfair to Gonzaga coming off a pair of wins to face a guy coming off a pair of losses.

  35. #35
    The Hurra Duff
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    Quote Originally Posted by PEN15 View Post
    No. Werdum is apparently next.
    Saw that in USA TODAY this morning.

  36. #36
    THE MONKEY
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    Chael Sonnen and Wanderlei Silva are the next coaches on TUF: Brazil. Really not sure how that will work seeing as I could see a major communication breakdown between coach and fighter with Chael.

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    They will provide him with a translator is all. Plus he has to have 24/7 security apparently.

  38. #38
    THE MONKEY
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    Well UFC 169 in Feb may not have Jones/Teixera headlining it but it did score two title matches. Jose Aldo vs Ricardo Lamas for the Featherweight title and Dominick Cruz vs Renan Barao to unify the Bantamweight title. Really hope Dominick can bounce back from two ACL surgeries, but fighting Barao after two years on the shelf is a really hard fight.

  39. #39
    Is Your Superior PEN15's Avatar
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    Eeesh. While I don't share the sentiments as strongly as some, combining the 2 lightest championships for a major PPV like this seems off. I don't expect big number for this show.

  40. #40
    THE MONKEY
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    It'll be typical of an Aldo PPV I'd imagine, somewhere in the 150,000-200,000 buy range. Also got Mir/Overeem on the card so looks like they are going the route of stacking the event.

    EDIT: Also I think they are probably expecting a sellout due to the bump they'll receive from being in the same city as the Super Bowl.
    Last edited by THE MONKEY; 10-30-2013 at 10:07 AM.

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